Monday, January 2, 2006
Sacred or Secular?
Shane's recently gotten a lot of questions and comments about the idea of sacred versus secular. What are your thoughts on the idea of God being present in all parts of your life and not just in those areas that we have deemed to be "sacred"? How can we make more of an effort to not compartmentalize our lives and to see God in all aspects of daily living?
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When striving to become more Christ like and putting effort into it - not just going to church but doing a devotional, worshipping w/out others, meditation, praying, etc. You entwine 2 parts of yourself, all things become sacred because their is no seperation of God from you, when you reflect on a decision to be made you consider what God would like you to do before making it. Therefore making the ordinary sacred. It really takes effort to make God apart of all of your life and not just parts. That is my thoughts anyway!
Posted by Marcia Rolfingsmeyer on 01/03/2006 02:25:02 AM
Very good points! But what about things like watching movies, eating dinner, listening to mainstream music? We tend to call those things secular, but are they really? Isn't God present in all aspects of our lives and not just those activities we have stamped with the term Christian?
Posted by dwellingplace on 01/03/2006 03:28:48 AM
Little by little we let go of the things that hold us back from being fully integrated with God. If we strive for purity then we would let go of things we find impure - but everyone must decide what is to much of a temptation in their lives... some people are not affected by movies, music, or eating dinner (you complete got me with eating dinner?). Sometimes you do not need to cut off your arm because it is sinning, but find a balance, an arm can be a great tool for doing good too! Eventually you will find yourself wanting to let go of certain actions and behaviors that you don’t think are pleasing to God. Music for some people (like myself) goes to the soul - when I sing it touches me - but for some people it is just background noise. I choose to listen to mostly Christian music and try to find a balance. I still have my fun music without God in it, but I have plenty of music to feed my soul. Is this a separation from God because they do not sing about God? I say NO - wither I sing praise, or sing about lost love - my soul still feels joy in both actions and with that joy I can give thanks and praise to God. SECULAR is just a word to label things that might lead us back to our old life without Christ. A life with Christ isn't throwing out all the old but using it to the advantage of the new person you have become and getting ride of the things that will cause too much temptation to slide away from your relationship with Christ. Hey, if R movies are too much for you, then get ride of them! It is better to continue your journey without things you may find a hindrance, as long as you don't hold that standard to others. We all battle our own demons, so to speak, but we don't all have the same ones.
Posted by Marcia Rolfingsmeyer on 01/03/2006 02:39:01 PM
Okay, I'm kind of cheating since I recently wrote on a similar topic. We tend to see this divide between the secular and the sacred and we don’t want to be “of this world”. Many of people choose to separate from mainstream culture, retreat to their Christian ghettos, rather than risk being tainted by the word. Good! Do what you have to do. A maturing believer knows their lines. However, and I say this with all due caution and humility, as we mature, we, like the apostle Paul, can expose ourselves to culture, draw the good out from it, interact with it in such a way as to use it for redemptive purposes. You see, while I understand what people are talking about when they talk about the "secular" world, maybe it would be better to see the whole world as God's. His Creation. It all being sacred. Yes, we are called to be priests, to be set apart; but set apart, not for our own comfort and edification, but for a purpose: to join in Christ’s redemptive mission.
Posted by Maurice Broaddus on 01/03/2006 05:19:51 PM
Okay, what about just making it a matter of practicing God's presence? I mean, I don't think this is just about what movies you watch or what places you hang out, or what music you listen to or what-not. But isn't about realizing that every aspect of your life is an opportunity to glorify God? I'm serving Christ when I work with the church youth group or sing in the choir. I'm ALSO serving Christ when I'm serving lunches at school or driving the bus or washing dishes at Papa John's. A teenage girl at church with a problem or too much stress is an opportunity for ministry. So is building a relationship with the girl who goes to the school that I work at during the day and works at the resturaunt I work at in the evening. NONE of my jobs could be considered "vocational ministry" or "sacred"... but they are. They are because I work there, and I'm called to His purposes. That makes everything I do "sacred" in a way, doesn't it? That includes the laundry or sweeping or cleaning the bathroom, and it includes ministering through my music or blogging. I kinda figure... it's everything. So there's my long-winded answer. Maybe we keep from compartmentalizing by doing everything with the realization that everything you do is sacred. ~Crystal
Posted by Crystal on 01/03/2006 08:05:02 PM
We think that we tend to compartmentalize without even realizing it, but after reading the other comments we thought of this. We have to be aware every moment of every day. What is sacred today may not be sacred for me tomorrow. IE... if I choose to read a book that might be termed as sacred because it is a good thing to do, and ignore a possible interchange that could lead to an opportunity to further the kingdom, how is that sacred? Is sacred vs. secular a response to what others think or what God thinks?
Posted by Ron&Angie on 01/04/2006 12:39:43 AM
The traditional connotation for "secular" in the church is "bad" or "wrong." Does that really ring true, though? Or are we hiding behind that term to separate ourselves from the rest of the world? For instance, Halloween is not only considered secular but gets termed by so many Christians as "Satan's Day." If I read my Bible correctly, though, every day is God's day, so am I really more righteous or spiritual if I don't allow my children to dress as their favorite cartoon characters and get candy from the neighbors? Also, separating ourselves from the rest of the world has traditionally become seen as a good thing, but how can we have an effect on the rest of our culture if we work so hard to live separately from it? Using the same example of Halloween, is it better for me to alienate my neighbors by refusing to participate? Or would it be more Christlike to build relationships with them as we both walk our costumed children door to door? Think about the stories we have of Christ on this earth. Was he seen more in those situations and events that were considered sacred or secular?
Posted by dwellingplace on 01/04/2006 01:21:20 AM
I would like some feedback on this issue. This morning I was listening to a local radio station and they were interviewing the lead singer of Relient K, a Christian group. As it turns out, he is dating one of the dj's. It seems apparent by her actions and words that she is not a Christian. I am unsure if I can listen to their music and worship with their music. I am not expecting perfection, but I am expecting that they live what they are singing about. Am I being hypocritical or am I falling into the sacred vs. secular trap?
Posted by Ron on 01/06/2006 12:21:34 AM
I'm not sure that this is a lot different than when spouses are not both believers. When I became a Christian, my husband was not a believer. Obviously, I couldn't divorce my daily life with him from my faith. I was still called to demonstrate Christ to him in a day-to-day setting. He was still created by God in His image. I couldn't classify him as "secular" and me as "sacred" because I was a believer. I couldn't call my time with him "secular" and my time alone "sacred." There are probably other things in this singer's life you may not agree with, as well; you just aren't aware of them. Every day I listen to music performed and sung by people who may not share my faith or who may share my faith, but don't always demonstrate it, just as I do not always demonstrate it. I believe as long as God is at the center of your listening, reminding yourself that you are using it as a way to grow closer to Him, making yourself aware of the fact that He is the one who gave you the senses to enjoy the music, acknowledging His presence at that moment, and yes, even being given the opportunity to pray for this person and that He is the one who calls you to do so, there is no reason to give up listening to this group's music.
Posted by Laurie on 01/10/2006 02:40:15 AM
Ron - Do you like there music? Does it make YOU feel closer to God? - then does it really matter who sung it, or helped in the singing of it? Did she write the song in question, probably not? So enjoy the song :) I wouldn't stop listening just becuase one of the band mates wasn't a Christian, if the song makes YOU closer to God then that is more important. But if it makes you dwell on the band mate (every time you listen) then make a decision, because it is either good music to jam too or it makes you feel convicted when you listen to it (in a good way or bad way). You know the song you know the song that say... wake up don't put a little makeup... Trust in my self rightous suicide I cry when angels deserve to die... I used to love that song but after listening to it more and more I think they are mocking Jesus and so now I do not find the same joy in hearing it so I change the channel. I don't really even care what the song really is about it doesn't bring me joy so I change it. Hope this helps :)
Posted by Marcia on 01/18/2006 06:28:08 PM
This may not sound very original or even particularly insightful, but I've never claimed to be either, so I'm off the hook there. I have started surrounding myself, or actually my office, which is in my home, with things like the Final Prayer we say each Sunday. I focus on one line a day and try to incorporate just THAT into my actions, thinking, whatever, for that day. Instead of trying to force God into a particular time of day, like first thing in the morning, I have found a Bible that divides Scripture into very small sections, so I read one small section every so often throughout my work day. I'll admit this won't work for everyone because I have a lot of freedom in my work schedule. I'm trying to remember that everything I look at, touch, hear, smell, taste is sacred because it comes from God. I try to pray over each patient I type about and each doctor I type for. I read and reread the Prayer of Oscar Romero. I've even taken my dictionary and blotted out the word "secular." Too radical? Maybe...but I doubt Daniel Webster will care.
Posted by Laurie goes Ba-Mystic on 02/11/2006 04:08:37 AM
I had to comment on this one. I don't view the world as sacred and secular, but more so as redeemed and in needing of redemption. Life is sacred and we fight against a culture and the church who compartmentalize everything. I value wholeness. Great blog!! Posted by theology4thefringes on 02/21/2006 02:18:47 AM
OOh! i like that! If I were God, and I created all that is in this world, and I thought up humanity and gave it unlimited potential that could create NYC and Microsoft, and saw humanity living out their existence on the face of Mother Earth, and then the few "Believers" started calling it all secular or "ungodly", I would be a little pissed at their ungratefulness. How about this - for those who are still stuck in the compartmental mode instead of sacred & secular, what if you thought like this: sacred & great unrecognized gift from God. To me it seems very much along the lines of what Shannon posted, its all beautiful, but only some of it gets captured and recognized as beautiful. When we don't recognize it, it starts looking old, dusty, or ugly, but that doesn't mean that its not vintage and valuable in its own way.
Posted by Josh on 02/21/2006 02:54:02 PM
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